HCG vs Testosterone - Reddit AMA #2, Part 2

Excerpt from our second Reddit AMA podcast video: What is HCG? What does it do? Is it better than Testosterone?

This editable transcript was computer generated and might contain errors. People can also change the text after it was created.

Brian Mckinley: Uh, yeah, we got a see. Our next guy is gonna be this denito, 5, 4 5, and so, there's a lot of text kind of from him. He has his own thread kind of going on. He's gotten hormone panels recently, So, I'm gonna do a little bit of a little bit of summarizing here. Essentially, he's looking at, I have some symptoms. Should I be on TRT? Some people are telling them. No. Some people are telling them. Yes, he's talking about potentially using hCG. Some people are telling him. No. And yes. And so his main symptoms when we ask them essentially like

Brian Mckinley:  You know, why are you looking at this? Why do you want to start this? Because he he's younger. I believe in his other thread. He mentions he's like, 21 or 24, or something like that. But his main things is that, he's always felt relatively behind behind his peers. I'm guessing and he says he's had like some gyno or man boobs, since he was in Grade 9 to 10. You know, he's done weight training, he's been eating better, but the kind of stayed and so, you know, we don't know for sure if that's real Gino, where it's like actual breast tissue growth, or if it's just, hey, you're overweight. You have a bigger chest, which is something I dealt with before. And so what he wants is to.

Brian Mckinley:  Improve muscle synthesis, some strength and improve some nagging pains especially in in a non-joint areas a increase overall energy desire for effort and focus and said he might have ADHD. And so yeah we were asking like Why do you want to do hCG and those are his reasons, right? And so we're going to talk about like I look at that I'm like okay. So For everyone there. What is hCG do, right? So that's that's a human chorionic gonadotropin, right? And essentially, what that does is it treats infertility one, right? It treats hypogonadism which is you know, smaller testes. If that is a problem and it essentially promotes natural testosterone production by treating

Brian Mckinley:  your testes. And so the only one thing out of those two things or those three things, he's got the infertility, the testy size and the testosterone. Well, The only thing out of all those that would treat those symptoms would be the increased testosterone production, right? So, if you're looking to improve those symptoms and you're doing hCG, you're only doing hCG for the testosterone. It sounds like you might benefit from a more direct measure of. Hey, you're just taking it for the testosterone. Testosterone Treatment. So TRT sounds like it might be what you're looking for versus the hCG because unless you're trying to get someone pregnant and you're having issues.

Brian Mckinley:  It just kind of seems like you're adding an extra step at least that's my general. Take on hCG versus TRT like, you might as well go with a more controlled route be more direct like. Okay, I can math out exactly what I need. I can adjust my dose a little bit easier because, you know, TRT is very straightforward milligrams per week. Equals how much test you're going to get to a variable. So you know, the tour four to six times. They're very predictable. So he's young, he may not need these things. I know that when I was young I just have to keep trying different diets in different workouts, but he also might

Brian Mckinley:  So Garrett, if you maybe want to take a look at some of his, his hormone panel results, or maybe share your thoughts on it, because, you know, he seems very he wants something is my take like, he wants to do something about it, but maybe I don't know is trt for him based on the hormone panels that he posted in that other thread. Maybe, you know, is your opinion, the same as my opinion of like TRT or, you know, give me maybe give me some of your thoughts on the more science portion of it.

Garrett Soames: Sure. So yeah hCG again it's a LH or luteinizing hormone analog The word analog again, implies that attaches to the same receptors. but is not actually, you know, a mimic of LH, so There was some thought that, you know, hCG would actually, suppress natural, LH production, you know, surprisingly, it doesn't this hCG actually. His primarily been used as a medication for fertility treatment and women. So it's, it's always used 100% time off label in men. This year where but the tests and women have shown no LH suppression by using HCG.

Garrett Soames: So LH the hormone. And hCG. essentially again, the analog They attach specifically to lay dig cells in the testicles. So there's two main types of cells. There's a lady and saratolli cells lady cells, only function is testosterone production. And the sir totally sells only function is produced production of sperm. So, those are our two functions, right? So if if you have a failing test, testicle testicular production of testosterone, hCG will ramp that up. And you can use it long term. You can use it forever because it doesn't suppress anything else. There's nothing it's suppresses.

Garrett Soames:  Which is kind of cool. That's one of the few things out there that doesn't cause you know, a lot of feedback loops on on different endocrine glands, but ultimately the way it increases fertility. even though it doesn't affect the serotoli cells for sperm, It increases your natural production of testosterone from the testes themselves, so which means you're intra testicular testosterone level the testosterone within the testicles itself. goes up, which is essentially, like adding It's like An accelerator, you know, on, on the testicles to produce more sperm. So each, that's why we use hCG in men for fertility issues, is it really? It increases your intratisticular testosterone? And the most interesting thing about all of this to me, is again, if you do a testosterone injections,

Garrett Soames:  all that testosterone goes all throughout your body, but the only place, it doesn't can't penetrate. But we literally can't penetrate into the testicles. So you're intratisticular testosterone, which is needed for sperm production drops. When you use exondenous, testosterone, but, you can take hCG while on TRT to keep up that intro to secure testosterone and keep, you know, at least some sperm production going. but if your goal is to completely forgo testosterone, Then technically there's no harm in using hCG long term. And but the only people who would ever choose the more expensive option. Which is less effective than testosterone injections as far as increasing testosterone levels.

Garrett Soames:  The only people who would ever choose that are people who are like literally actively right now today trying to get their their female spouse pregnant. so,

Garrett Soames:  If your goal you can maintain fertility by doing bursts of hCG, you can take Clomid, you can take other things. Typically, you don't need those long-term, but if hCG were five bucks, I'd say, Yeah. Go for it. The HCG is not cheap. It just it isn't. It's not oh,

Brian Mckinley: Yeah, even from us, even from our compounding, pharmacies testosterone is significantly. Cheaper compared to HCG.

Garrett Soames:  Yeah, yeah. So you know, I would say to this guy Sure. Go that route if you want, but if your goal if, if you're you'll increase some testosterone, you may feel better if you have hypogonatal symptoms,

Garrett Soames:  But you definitely won't feel as good as you would. You know, at least physically speaking, you wouldn't get the same physique benefits or any of the other benefits of higher testosterone levels. um, as you would with testosterone and your levels wouldn't get nowhere, near what you can get, you know, because you're basically squeezing the testicles like work harder, And you know, so you may increase your production by 50%. But if you're already at 250 350 You know, it isn't really gonna change things.

Garrett Soames: So yeah, that's that's my that's on that,…

Brian Mckinley:  Yeah.

Garrett Soames: you know?

Brian Mckinley:  And that's, that's true too because, you know, Looking at his other thread where he had the hormones, he was at about 350 free testosterone.

Garrett Soames: Yeah, so if that was before hCG, you know, if you add 50% to that, you know, what is that? I'm not great at math. So I'd be like, 500, something 520, You…

Brian Mckinley:  Yeah.

Garrett Soames: not. Not bad, you know, but You do a cheap and…

Brian Mckinley:  But you can do it cheaper and better.

Garrett Soames: you we get you to 1,000, You…

Brian Mckinley:  You know.

Garrett Soames: your level could be a thousand and you'd have twice the physique benefits twice. Those, you know benefits, but again, you know that, that's what's so interesting about all this is, you know, a lot of these online clinics are just cookie cutters. It's like Here's your plan. We don't care here, Here's your dose whatever, but there's so much individual. You know. Variance with all of this, that we have to treat each person individually. So, if someone came to us and they were like, I just want to do hCG monotherapy and this is why and, you know, if it made sense sure but

Brian Mckinley: Yeah. Yeah.

Garrett Soames:  I haven't, I, I guess, I personally haven't met that patient yet, who, you know, who wants that, or where that makes sense for

Brian Mckinley: Yeah, so Danito, I got to tell you I was a bigger kid. I dealt with a lot of overweight issues, and Diet and exercise really helped me. I later in life, had testosterone very similar to you. Maybe even lower, I believe it was. But you know that 350 that is kind of on the lower end. And if these are some of your concerns and you have some weight to lose from it all, I've got to say is like that's what I did. It helped it put me back to where I was supposed to be it let me be the man that I wanted to be and felt like I deserve to be so you know. Try whatever. You're trying work with your doctors, but in terms of should you take HCG TRT? Would it help you? Yes, it would help you with the goals. Yes, it would help you because the testosterone you have

Brian Mckinley:  TRT is going to be better than hCG for you you know hope this video helps a little bit good luck, let us know and if you know you want to work with us. Cool too. If you want to work with the provider working with also, cool, just hope it work